`Control over land is the biggest issue facing people today'

`Control over land is the biggest issue facing people today'
Shobhan Saxena

Jal, jungle aur jamin, yeh sab ho janta ke adhin. (People should have control over land, water and forest). P.V. Rajagopal, head of the Ekta Parishad, one of the biggest people's organisations in India, has been campaigning for land rights of Madhya Pradesh's tribals for the past three decades. On December 10, 1999, he started a padyatra at Chambal that ended at Raigarh on June 19, 2000. Passing through 3,000 villages, Rajagopal met around 10 lakh people from 10,000 villages and walked for 3,200 kilometres to mobilise people against the government's anti-people policies. He spoke to SHOBHAN SAXENA about the satyagraha.

What are the issues you want to raise through the Bhu-Adhikar satyagraha?
The biggest problem is people's control over land. Those who have pattas don't have land and those with land don't have pattas. We have been demanding the conversion of forest villages into revenue villages so that they get development funds, water and electricity. In the Chambal region, Vinoba Bhave got 200,000 acres for bhudan. Now, most of it is in the hands of rich landlords or the forest department. The government has given industrial land to big industrial houses at the price of agricultural land. People are losing control over land, water and forests.

But why a padyatra? Aren't there other ways of raising awareness?
This is one of the best modes to interact with people. Modern methods of communication are not going to work. You need to be with people, you have to share their lives if you want to know their problems. People are struggling to survive on a day-to-day basis. They need permanent partners in this struggle. People's organisations have to come together. Meetings and conferences in big cities are not enough.

Lastly, the state is getting brutal. It has no sympathy for the poor. They talk of Panchayati Raj, but the panchayats have no real power. So we realised the need to come together, act together and challenge the policies of the day.

Where has the government failed?
OH, the list can be quite long, but basically the government has failed on three fronts. In MP, social legislation and policies that are meant for the poor like the Land Ceiling Act, Minimum Wages Act, equal wages for equal work, Adivasi Suraksha etc have not been implemented. Secondly, anti-poor policies are being implemented with full enthusiasm. Through the industrialisation policy, people are being deprived of land, water and forest. The third problem is the World Bank-backed social forestry project, which has displaced more than 4.5 lakh people.

So this prompted you to walk...
Yes. But what pushed me was a brutal act of repression against the Baigas, who are ironically our national tribe, in Mandla district. More than 70 huts and 300 acres of crops belonging the Baigas were burnt down by the forest department. And this was repeated 8-9 times. It was time to challenge this direct attack on people and their resources by the state.

Are you saying that people are in a miserable shape because of government policies?
Yes. The government doesn't care for people. In Chambal, people were given pattas 30 years ago, but they still haven't got possession till now. Around the Kanha National Park, people's land has been taken away. The forest department has taken away kulhadis of hundreds of thousands of people. They have been stopped from cutting wood. That's the only vocation they know. If their cattle stray into the national parks, they have to pay fines. But if the wild boars destroy their crop or tigers kill their cattle, they have to wait for years to get compensation.

What is the situation at the ground level?
People are really helpless. In Malda, 15 people have been in jail for the past three years on a false charge of killing a forest official. They can't even organise bail. People displaced from the Kanha National Park 20 years ago have been rehabilitated on a dry, rocky patch of land without any water, power, health care or education. People have stopped keeping cattle because animals stray into the forest. The forest department is the real villain. It has burnt their houses many times. People are living like refugees in their own country.

What was the response to the padyatra?
The response was tremendous. I met hundreds of thousands of people who are waiting for outside help. They have seen people coming to exploit them, for votes, liquor in hand, but nobody has come to articulate their problems. And if people ever tried to raise these issues they were branded as Naxals.

Did the government create any roadblocks?
Surprisingly, the government response was positive too, but not because of a change of heart. During the yatra, three Ekta Parishad activists were arrested on the false charge of being Naxals. Then we sat on a dharna in front of the thana and the government released them. Perhaps, they realised the growing mobilisation of people. The second positive thing is that the government has set up a committee to look into the problems of tribal people. How far they will come with us is yet to be seen.

But doesn't Digvijay Singh have the image of being a caring and progressive Chief Minister?
He has a image of a populist CM. On one hand, he is backing the brutal industrialisation in the state and on the other, he is trying to be popular by pursuing a populist agenda. He has been borrowing terms like gram swaraj from Gandhi but hasn't done anything concrete yet.

What has this sataygraha achieved?
Since Independence, the government has been abusing power. Through this movement, an attempt has been made to show that people can challenge the state. In the last 50 years, the Indian state has injected fear into the minds of people. We organised more than 4,000 youths during the yatra who will work as our grassroots cadre. We also plan to take the anti-liquor agitation forward in a big way.

Where do you go from here?
On September 11, we plan to launch Ghar Vapsi Andolan, during which people displaced from the national parks will force their way into the parks and occupy them. Then on the Independence Day, we plan to gherao MLAs to take notice of our demands. And on October 2, more than 20,000 people will do a sit-in on the Gwalior-Bombay national highway.

Some say foreign money is financing these agitations. It's a fact that several NGOs get their money from abroad.
The salary of the chief secretary of the state comes from foreign funds now. Corporate houses are being run by foreign money. But if a Rs 800 crore World Bank scheme can be opposed by Rs 4 lakh from a donor agency, is that wrong? And foreign money doesn't mean foreign ideas.

Are Gandhians methods relevant in today's times?
Yes, very much. Today, Gandhi is being used by many anti-Gandhians, people who do not believe in him but use his name to further their cause. Gandhi's non-violent direct action is very useful. But it has not been tried out effectively. People have rejected it without using it.

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